Jim Cramer on Mad Money's 20-year run, the IPO market, Google antitrust, and why he's bullish on monopolies

got the book. Come on in.

Come on in.

Welcome to the show. Good to see you. It's been too long. Thank you so [laughter] much. Where's the gun? There we go.

He was so ready. He was so ready.

Hit it again.

Get a clean hit. A clean hit.

There we go.

That's fantastic.

There's an entry.

You guys look fabulous. I love it. It's a great home for you.

We love it. We love it. Every time we're here, we're we're we're enjoying it very much.

Thank you for having us. You're basically the Are you the mayor?

Um, yeah. I'm more of an official greeter. I'm more of an ambassador.

So, so 20 years on Mad Money, correct? How many time How many years in this building? How How long have you been working here for about I guess like four. We were in Englewood with Cliffs for a long time and we had a studio for us. It's very interesting you asked this because now this is our studio. Uh, you can't control the sound levels of who's here or whatever. But I I kind of still feel it's heart of capitalism. I really do. Okay. It's a spiritual home.

Yes. And I do like wall and I do like broad and I do think that that there's a level of excitement. Not the way it was when I got in the business in ' 82 when I first walked down the street and it was an engine.

It's more tourist now taking a look at it. But I still find it fascinating the companies that come public, the companies that you know that I'm trying to learn learn about

and it's uh exciting. It truly is exciting. Every day I walk in the building.

Do do you think there's an advantage to being here? Do you think there's an advantage to getting guests in person? When I think about the highlights uh just from this year, I think about you going to Tim Cook and touring the iPhone factory. That was a really cool moment. I also think about you beefing with uh I also think about you, you know, going back and forth with Benny off remotely. Talk to me about like when do you want to go to a person? When do you want them to come to you? When do you when are you okay having just a phone call?

This is a fabulous question because I waffle on this. I did think as I was telling your terrific people out there that there would be more execs that just would come through and they don't

and we were near Teterboro at the other place and they do and uh I like to be out in person on the road all the time. Uh the issue of course is we do three segments [laughter] there interviews do a lot of the

issue is there's no time in the day.

Yeah. You're always on TV.

It's hard. We wrestle with this too. uh you know like like you can go and travel to someone, make a big performance out of it. Uh we we we we're in Los Angeles, which is not a great place, but it's it works. It works in many ways, but it's also odd. Like we would assume that we're in San Francisco or at least New York. We're in

New York.

Well, the funny thing the funny thing if you were getting started today, it's very possible that you would be walking around like one of these live streamers who I know I know like speed came through here at one point. You'd be walking around, you'd be on basically 24/7. You'd have your phone open. You'd be looking at the markets and you would be able to just constantly be traveling around. Yes. Well, you guys do stuff where you did you said something the other day. There was a guy who said you thought he was at a booth

at that incredible reinvention, right? Reinvent. But he was really not at the booth. But the other guy was saying, "Oh, yeah, he's around here somewhere."

Yeah. Yeah. That's [laughter] Simon from Turbo.

You pretend to be in the booth all of the time. Uh, but I I do find that the people in general are really nice. There's a a code of niceness here that's almost like written in and it's so non New York.

Uh but I like it.

What about when you when you can't be perfectly nice because uh things just aren't going well for a CEO and and maybe you I always think back to that interview you did with Tim Cook. I think it was about a decade ago. They'd missed uh I think they'd missed earnings and and the stock was selling off and you needed to ask the hard question what the re what the what the street was saying, but you didn't want to, you know, come at him too aggressively. How do you think about that?

Well, it's very funny.

Yeah.

I often go over these with my wife who's my partner. Okay. And I'll say, "Look, I want to be gracious. Does this sound gracious?" No, [laughter] you're killing. How about I add this? She goes, "Oh, yeah, that's great. You're killing You're asking about his wife." I mean, I I I do find that what happens is the facts dictate the graciousness. And if a guy misses a quarter and says that the quarter is good,

well, he's a free fire. Okay? If a woman comes on and and says, "Look, we we had a founder recently who I won't name who said that he was making, you know, 30, he was basically selling a product for $30,000 and he was telling customers, we have so much demand, I can't support you." And then a minute later, he was like, "Well, we've expanded capacity so much." And I was like, "Well, why don't you call the people you told you didn't have capacity two days ago?" [laughter]

You nailed them. You nailed them. I mean, and it's like I don't know. I think I'm curious how you think about this. It's like I would say most of the people coming on your show, you have some level of respect for what they're doing.

And I think that's important, right? That that that if you if you have respect for a person, it means you're going to be fair, right? You're not they're not your enemy. You're just trying to have a real conversation, understand. Well put.

Um, and then I'm sure plenty of times you've had people coming on that you got a little beef with behind the scenes, but for the most part it's like you want to you want to you want to have people you want to invite people on that you're genuinely excited to have a conversation with, even if you might be a little bearish, might be might be more bullish, right?

Well, let's talk about Beni off. I'm interviewing him tonight. The previous quarter I did not like. Okay. And he came on like gang busters that it was a great quarter. And that caused me to do something I don't like to do, which is interrupt mid-sentence because someone's talking and it we all we grew up thinking our mothers told us that would be rude. So now I'm into the rude element, right? And first he thinks that the rude element is a bit of a

uh for show, you know, it's like, oh, he's a little Broadway action. No, it was like I'm not buying it. I'm not buying what you're selling. And then like in the middle of it, I thought that Mark realized, geez, I think I think Jim was a bad quarter. And then by the end of it, he said, "Wow, Kramer hates me." No, it's not. It's not. I don't hate anybody, right? But the fact is is that this quarter was the quarterations have you had with Benny Off live on the air? Probably

maybe. Yeah, probably probably I guess 50 60,

but I I there was a period where during the during the uh I was going to call it the plague uh that I talked to him every day. Well, we were trying to develop a contest to develop the best mask

and it it got way laid, but we were just wanted awareness.

Sure. Sure. Sure. You were working together on a project, right? But I look I do I I I've identified him as a friend because he came to my he was one of I guess two CEOs that came to my wedding and there were 53 people there.

Only two. That's a small club.

And with 53 people if you could just throw a stone you hit a couple of them.

Yeah. You got you got to ask. [laughter]

I'm [laughter] sorry.

This is exciting. You guys are exciting. Okay.

No, you're exciting. You're exciting. You are so you are genuinely uh people people in our world uh do ask us time to time they're like you guys are crazy you started a business that you can't stop working on like we are we are we make the business every day

and I see it and and and we tell people like do you do you think you see Kramer you don't think he loves what he does and that's exactly what we want to do we love we love we love that we get to meet up every day and talk about the stuff that we're interested in I can He doing it for decades and decades and decades.

Absolutely. I mean, it's a little like my buddy Shar ESPN couldn't stop no matter what. I mean, every time he looks at somebody, he's he's thinking about, is that person going to do a trade? Is that what's that person thinking? But most of the people are just kind of, okay, I'm on TV.

And I, my executive producer, Regina Gil, always says there's two kinds of people. There's people who are on TV because they want to be on TV, and then there's people who are on TV because they have something to say. And you guys have something to say. And what I love about it is is that you have much better BS detector. Not to be like I know that sounds prosaic, but the fact is I'll I'll hear that Amazon's chip

is the best in the world from Amazon and I'll say

h maybe it's the best in the world. I mean I'll actually in my head they'll be like best in world best in world but the hard Amazon my book came. So yeah, so so uh obviously anything anything in chip space is tough, but even harder and I think something that uh maybe uh the east coast hasn't been quite as tapped into is determining which hard tech and deep tech companies are real because there's there's there's a lot of companies that are uh the west coast calls them like render companies. They make really cool visual renders, CGI, like very cool like sci-fi experiences and then nothing ever comes to fruition. And so it's easier to clock those companies from the west coast because of just the whisper networks and and you might know somebody that worked at the company. You might know their investors. You can uh if a company gets to series D and they haven't had a single tier one ever invest or participate, you know this so well. I mean like people it was a series C blah blah blah. And I'm like thinking series C? Okay. Like that was didn't I take that exam to be able to walk on the floor? [laughter] But you have you you speak the language and you but you don't make it so I can't learn the language. You you want me you want me to learn the language which I have going for me history and that's my edge. So for instance today Micron got out of the what I regard as the most consumer now I've been begging them to get out of the consumer for for actually literally for 20 years because they have a high-end and then they have the the low end and the low end gives them the 10 multiple and the highend gives them the 20 multiple. And I've been talking to Sanjay whom I really like. And I was like, I was like, Sanjay, you have to like do this. And he's like, Jim, I don't need to do that. And so today he does it. The stock's down 12. So I text him. I said, come on. He goes, I'm in quiet. I'm like, and I wrote, I'm not in quiet. I think you're fabulous. [laughter] And but that's cuz I remember the 95 breakdown where the what happened is is that that old piece of capital goods equipment came out that could make a little more than we needed for the of the memory chips and then it goes like that. and his stock have been number one and then 500 number one.

Do you remember some of Do you remember some of this stuff better than the CEOs and the management teams?

Yeah. Always.

If it's the 90 Absolutely. If it's the '90s

like for Intel when I speak with them.

Yeah.

I mean, look, I'm not I'm an idiot.

And and there's new leadership.

Yeah. But I would tell you like I forgot my anniversary and my wife's and my and my wife's birthday. But I remember the the September collapse in '95. But that's cuz it's all wrong. I have a memory for some things and they're the wrong things except for when we're in here. [laughter]

What are they doing out there? You are sust.

Oh, we love to. We love to. The show will be wrapped up by then.

Okay. So, when you're out there, one thing later, one thing later with with Ben off. Uh, you got to you got to uh ask him about token consumption because he came out with

3.5 trillion. Was it three or one? I don't I don't number but it sounds like a big number but there were some other companies there was AlphaSense somebody at Alpha Sense was sharing they were sharing that they use around half the tokens obviously not quite the same scale much

you know Jensen wouldn't give you Jensen wouldn't

give you that rap I mean I remember when he did a a me uh when I walked in there was me and he said look this was you know you don't know how many tokens we're using and all it really came down to there was this show at that point mayor of Easttown but there's There's a new one called Task and all that Jensen wanted to talk about was when he was doing me how hard that Philadelphia l was at the end. And Kate Kate Winsler said the same thing. This man is Da Vinci. He knows acting. He knows plays. He knows, you know, he's a well-rounded guy, but all he does now is like

got good taste in jackets.

But how about all the stuff he has to talk about?

Uh what do you what do you uh how have you been processing all you know everybody competing to say the biggest number? Right. Oh god. I have a piece tonight that starts and I mentioned you guys right at the top because I'm like well no because like I say that that this is what you guys do and I don't want to do it [laughter] but because I can't I can't do it like you. You don't want to aspire to be someone who's not as good as you. Hey, I came in you know I'm like I am I'm not as good as Jordy. What a day. You know your wife doesn't want to hear that when you come in. [laughter] You know John was like I was so embarrassed. John had to be. No, but but but when you're in the these situations, you don't want to be in, well, next week, uh, Open AI's got a new chat GPT that's better than Gemini. If you just said, "Holy S, Gemini is the best." You don't want to be in that world. And yet, you guys know that that world is fluid.

And I don't want to be in a world where suddenly uh I'm going to give an example. Broadcom is a general c contractor for a lot of these chips. But, you know, what's the general contractor? Does that work? Does that mean that they really had a lot of say? I don't know. You guys would literally know what it means to to be what Broadcom is in the chain. I, on the other hand, is saying, "Hey, Broadcom should go up big because of this."

Well, you know, one is like, "Hey, you know what? I think that one's no line and one is a line. Hey, you know, guess what? I think I I I I think the Patriots have a better chance than than the than Cleveland. Well, yeah. No kidding. That's why there's a line. You guys set the line. Okay. I'm money line on everything." Well, yeah, we know we know we know our lane, too. I mean, from being from the being from the West Coast and coming from a private markets background, we focus on market cap. You focus on stock price, how the stock is moving dayto-day. We, I think, are much more uh we're much more focused on the product side.

What is the most sound on your soundboard?

Okay.

What do we got that's underrated? on mine right now. I think my mother I I happen to think

there there's a sound right at the

uh at the bottom right which was from off which was from Office Depot. That was easy. That was easy. [laughter] But but that was when the show started. Now people just say like what was that? I don't remember that. You got paper there.

The button the button [laughter] but I think it's so cool. But like people are saying like what what is that? It was that a chain or something? And so it's it's it's become a relic, but it's

Yeah. Yeah. It's hard to keep the lore going. I mean, we already sound. You know what this sound is?

That's That's uh Call of Duty goggles going. We We grew up on Call of Duty.

I still don't understand why he does that.

I grew up on Pong.

Okay. [laughter]

Right. I mean, I thought Pong was incredible until Donkey Kong. Like Donkey Kong was incredible. These things were incredible cuz they replace cross word puzzles and uh tic-tac-toe.

Yeah.

Yeah. Right. Twitch. Who owns Twitch?

Amazon.

Amazon.

Of course. We got to get Andy Jasse on Twitch. You know what? I wanted to do earnings. I wanted to post earnings on Twitch live. You know what?

Mark Zuckerberg's on Instagram fronting [laughter] videos. Get Andy Jassie on Twitch. Jassie Zuckerberg. No, he's got no salary capable [laughter] guy, right? Everyone else had this kind of soda salary cap.

It doesn't exist. good. How Roseman is good. No, he sucks compared to Zuckerberg cuz he's got the salary cap,

you know. You know, uh some some some something interesting on the on the Amazon front. Uh the trainium when they they were talking about No, no. When they're talking about their new chip, they specifically uh they specifically mentioned doing a training run for a company called Dart Dean, the founders, which I only know. They do they do they do realtime video uh and uh they're working with a lot of Twitch streamers. So that that that that training run felt meaningful and I don't think a lot of people picked up on that but something moving.

I mean that's a good example of what I would describe as why I'm you look I never lose sight that I'm a generalist because I wouldn't know that in the same way that I wouldn't necessarily know if we were doing steel steel companies whether something's cold rolled or hot roll. cold rollers have got a high multiple and hot rollers, you know, the steel steel and so you always have to be really careful knowing knowing that you don't know certain things. Uh like I I wouldn't if there are certain specs put out uh on ASIC Google I I I have to be very careful because when I listen to what you know what Andy Chassio will call me and he'll school me and he'll be right to school me because I don't know enough. Who's the next uh Mark Beni off in the sense of a CEO that you could see yourself uh just enjoying interviewing?

Okay, I'm going to give you a crazy I'm going to give you a crazy one because it's it's going to be I have to make it so it's enjoying. I haven't gotten there yet. It's le I intend to get him.

We got to talk about espresso. Espresso talking about coffee.

He's obsessed with coffee. Yeah, we spent like 10 minutes. We'll send you the clip. [laughter] This is the show talking about and he also likes long long distance biking and riding.

Oh my god. He's not carp. He doesn't want to kill.

You're the tough thing. You got a three minute segment. It's hard to spend it's hard to spend three minutes.

You give him more time because I didn't know he I didn't know he had that side. I know he cares passionately about Ukraine. I know that he cares passionately more importantly about making people who who should get credit in a country where you still have to care about democracy. He's dem he's the you know everyone say well I'm democratizing I'm democratizing blue jeans you know I'm democratizing t-shirts. No he's democratizing capital and why not his his algo is better. Uh I just think he's that's the guy I intend to be able to get him out of his it's not a shell. I don't know what it is.

What the hell? I think I think uh my my sense was like the conversation for us we had 30 minutes, right? You're you don't have the luxury of having that much time with with some of these guests. But some some people take a while to warm up and that's why that's why that's why sometimes that's why traditional podcast calls, get to know someone, then hop on and even if it's a shorter segment, you can you can do it.

Oh, good. That's a goal then. It's a goal. And the reason I want to do it is because I find him completely fascinating. He came on the show when the stock I told him, "Come on the show when you think it's going to break out, will you?" It was going down. It was at 33. He came on the show and I said, "Well, I what do you think here?" And he goes, "Well, the stock is now done going down and it's going up." No one ever says that. No one. They never comment the Oh, well, Jim, that's you. That's out there. We don't know. No. He said, "No, the stock's now done going down." And it's like at the end of the interview, I said, "That was a gutsy call." And he goes, "What?" I said, "That is done going down." He goes, "Why is that gutsy?" There's my guy.

Extremely [laughter] gutsy. It's extremely good. I love it. I love it. How do you think about uh about market structure, igopolies, monopolies, because uh the real interesting side of Max Levchin and a firm is looking at Sebastian and Clara because now there's two companies in the same space. You can comp them. It's a little bit of horse race. That feels like good content. Feels like good opportunity for investors. How do you think about a market like that?

All right. So, I I'm out of the closet this going to say it here. I always tell people, look, what I'm looking for are companies that in many ways are the worst thing that could ever happen for our country. I'm looking for monopolies because monopolies uh monopolies just they've got the gross margin. I just want big gross margins. Nothing like did you guys ever read Rockefeller by Chernel?

Yeah.

Yeah. The guy had 100%. We had 100% of the oil market. That's my [laughter] guy. And when they broke it up, they created just a huge amount of wealth. But no, I I I look for Monopoulos. Yeah. or and I'm happy with Allegoblas like right now Lind uh Lyn Lindy which energy company industrial gas and uh and air products there are they're a slap happy uh duopoly right now and they should be raising prices they're like not being good duopolis but that's you know it's kind of

I just always take so much away from the Uber and lift saga that I sort of grew up with I might be overfitting to that

you know Postmates

yeah uh

I like Postmates they weren't they acquired in right

yeah by Uber right yeah Bastion Bastion's the fashion was the first guy to come on and give me a hat. I said, "What am I going to do with that?" He goes, "It's called swag. What do I swag?" "Well, you put it on your head."

Shocker. [laughter]

Wait, how are you how have you been processing uh Google then? Uh because Google

Oh my god. Okay. Got out of Google. Get this. There was some guy I would call him a clown, but this is a serious show. uh from the Justice Department who convinced me that they were going to take put Google in the same bed that James Khan was in in the in the show Misery, you know, going to hobble him. [laughter] And he said, "Listen, we're going to hobble him." I mean, like, you know, make it so he can't walk. Yeah, that's it. And I took him seriously and I spoke to Google's attorney who was of course much smarter than than the Justice Department. But I believed the Justice Department. I thought that they were going to wreck the company. And they kept saying over and over again, "And we're not going to let it be like Microsoft,

you know, we let Microsoft off. this is not and I got nervous uh and I p I didn't I didn't panic but when you have the justice department over and over saying listen I don't why are you saying these things you don't know what's going to happen to them and then you get a judge who finds him a monopolist like man I got to get out of this thing this is bad news and then the judge like 3 months later says technology's overtaken it not only is it not a monopoly but we think it's great that they paid Apple 20 billion to knock out everybody else I was dead I was dead I was flat and I was road killed it didn't matter whatever I did was ran All you do is look at it and say, "I'm stupid. I'm stupid. I'm stupid."

Yeah. But the real the real thing that hasn't played out yet is like what what happens if we do end up with a duopoly in search, right? A lot of people I mean Chachi has 800 million weekly active is going to have

because they may, you know, they don't have the balance sheet. You guys read Nile Ferguson, Pity of War.

Well, that is about whoever has the deepest bond market wins. Uh sent your money. I mean, he's got the bond market is better for the other guys. So yeah, this is a question for you because it felt it like I felt very comfortable covering the AI horse race, the the foundation model race from a technologies perspective, from a venture capital perspective, but once the discussion moved to is there enough private credit, is Blue Owl going to underwrite these right at these right levels? [laughter] Uh, you know, we're having John from Apollo on the show. I hope you can explain it to us a little bit more, but how do you think about if uh if a story kind of leaves your orbit? Do you just bringing people on to understand?

Well, I mean, balance sheet all the time and and uh it's funny because I have a general show and I'm always afraid to bring the balance sheet up for people say you know gez I want to see what's on the price is right I mean those like dial anywhere but that oh friends there's friends you know look for old old Seinfelds versus me talking about the balance we have to do

for some people out there that's that's their super bowl right they [laughter] love they love it right so

look I get a kick out of the idea that you that Oracle gets involved and that Larry Ellison who is one of the toughest guys on earth who's never made a mistake and Saffra Katz has never made a mistake are getting involved and then Saffer leaves

and the FT says she leaves because she doesn't want what's happened to the balance sheet her precious balance sheet of Oracle which is not that good to begin with so that's a good story for me because that's

Larry has Larry did uh no he's never been on the show he follows TVPN uh

he does he does he follow very he followed very No, but but uh what was your relationship like with with Larry? Did he come on? Did he

Larry? No. No, I never and like I've tried repeatedly, but I won't I won't get on my knees. I mean,

he doesn't do a lot of media.

I think he might talk about like University of Michigan. Okay.

Do you think that Mark Cuban he's been on your show? Do you think he's the reason why Indiana is such a good football team?

Oh, [laughter] we have no idea. people people have used the ESPN of tech on us. But it was funny cuz I've maybe

watched Yeah, maybe I've watched like an hour of sports in the last

What do you read into the co-CEOs when you see something like that?

Yeah, I mean my

Yeah, here we go. No, I coco basically.

Yeah, it's just really hard in capital now. That's obviously a big focus of ours.

Well, Benov was coco with with Keith Block. That was just suboptimal situation.

Uh we got the coco now at Oracle. Let's see what happens. I think it's hard unless you can have really defined duties like they had at workday.

Uh and uh but but otherwise, no, it's not something I really want want to see. Yeah.

Uh, how are you feeling about that? How are you feeling about the the IPO market?

I think it's it's too robust. We're seeing a lot of junk.

Uh, we're seeing a lot of biotech, by the way, which is why the biotech instrument companies are doing well, but a lot of these are one-trick ponies,

and that's really dangerous. I I look, I don't want to protect anybody from investing in anything because everybody has a right to invest in everybody. Well, you know, if you were to do a uranium company right now, a company which just says and all it does is say we will find uranium and you use a really funny symbol like you know five used instead of four. I mean look it you know you you price it at 15 it opens at 24 and then you wait 6 months and you sell every share

and that's what I'm afraid of.

Yeah.

Not too are the biotech companies taking advantage of the AI narrative or is there a particularly different narrative?

No, I think that there's just been a lot of I shouldn't say it. there's been

that's starting to bubble up in in tech in Silicon Valley folks saying hey in the future uh drug discovery is going to be accelerated the timeline's going to be way shorter it's the economics are going to be completely different

but this the big companies are just they're just sales companies because when you go to the unbelievably cool great person who does healthcare you know and Nvidia say that person doesn't they're not you know Bristol Myers isn't give me give me help it's not those guys it's not those guys and it really bothers me because If you're going to accelerate what's going on with cancer, okay, so that you can do, you know, look at every single data point, uh, and know everything within within 5 minutes, you should be able to come up with the holy grail drug that, you know, blood test. Uh, they're getting a blood test for prostate cancer. I saw a guy down here saying that today. He's going to become public, I hope. But, uh, they should be using it and we should be making far more progress than we're doing in healthcare. It's just, you know, when Jensen came on uh with uh with Synopsis, I mean, it's pretty clear they're doing the digital doing the digital twin.

By the way, you know, I thought the digital twin would have been good with with vision with vision pro, but I guess

relic, I don't know.

But I I do think that that's the missing link. Like, and I think if anybody does it, it's going to be Lily and Dave Bricks because he can get outside himself and think about some ideas.

Yeah, I like him a lot.

You do?

Has he been on the show?

No, not yet. But he hit a trillion time.

We rang the gone for because he hit a trillion dollar valuation.

Yeah. Wasn't that great?

That's fantastic.

Walmart's at 900.

That guy Walmart, that guy Doug McMillan, the guy's retiring. I mean, he created the stock when he came in. Gave huge bonuses.

You want to crater it when you leave. You want to crater it when you leave.

Have you been to Walmart lately?

There's an interesting there's an interesting bull case for Walmart is that they are leaning in with Chat GPT while Amazon's leaning out. And so if the agentic commerce thing happens and people are just opening up their phone and saying, "Hey, order." It will probably be routed through Walmart in the short term.

Really?

Yeah. So Etsy will have to respond into a partnership somewhere.

Etsy and Walmart have leaned in. eBay and Amazon have leaned out.

Wow. Etsy had a good quarter. Etsy had a bad quarter.

Uh Amazon, we know.

Yeah. And so, and so it's the it's the lagards in the markets that are that are trying to catch up by saying, "Hey, we missed maybe we missed the, you know, the real power line."

I thought it was interesting if Costco's deep into uh uh Agent Force. Do you think Mark's going to rename the company Agent Force? This is my first question to him.

Look at all the different silos. Go to the page 18 on the deck and there it is. 178. It's like everything's Asian. You know, all the different things he now called Asian. The thing is he's still hiring sales people like crazy is going to rename Meta.

Did you see the rumor today, but he's just going to call it

rename he just re that was that was

but my my whole thing is I think it's actually I think it's a good name. It actually is the metaverse. People spend so many hours in it. It doesn't matter that it's not in goggles. They're spending it on their phone. They're on their computer. It doesn't it doesn't matter that it's not in a heads up display yet. It is a universal touch point. It's like they even adapted the app so it is messaging focused. It's not even like it's hard to post content on Instagram now. That's my only metaphorical universe. But you know maybe with Ver Rubin they can do high-speed video uh short 10-second clip for an ad on Insta and that might work. I mean right now I would put it in Reddit. I don't know. Have you seen the rates for Reddit? The rate card?

No.

It's like a fraction and it's very targeted and it's really good. And I'm looking at Reddit ads. Reddit ads are the cheapest bargain for any consumer package because you're right targeted. Like my wife has this mascal business. Boom. There's like a mascal lovey mascal love, you know. Everything's like love melanomi. My daughter's on unfortunately she beat it. But that's like that's targeted targeted target. I really like that because the rates I told he's charging too little.

Well, isn't he making much money from selling data? Isn't he making a lot of money from selling data?

Yes, he is. And then Cloudflare's doing their best to be able to block. But you did Cloud Player, you did the implications of of their failure to [laughter] see now there. Did Matthew not Don't Call Me Matt. Did he call you?

Uh he he came Matthew came out once, right?

Was he good?

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know, he's great.

He's real smart.

Yeah.

Maybe we should talk about like who's like a really good guest and who's bad. And won't [laughter] mention the name of the bad. We'll just say the good, you know. Oh yeah, that guy. He's an amazing consumer.

The team that you got to have on. You got to have the semi analysis team on. Uh the piece was too long. The one that you told me to read the 10,000 word too long. I was like, "Oh my god, look at that. Look what's a jet game. I got to go watch it." No,

Dylan will always call in. He'll be at some data center usually outside in the back of a pickup truck. He'll call in and he's he's absolutely the whole team there is absolutely fantastic. They're very good. They're really I trust them implicitly for when you have something on Jensen.

You look at these two, you know, have you met Eric Lyman yet? going after you got fantastic. Look at that. Look at that. 26 ramp. That's That's Isn't that the doing a C round? 26

R. C.

What should I always say?

Be here any day.

Oh, and then what what should I say if I want to say if I want to impress people about how far along I am? Should I say I just did myself what series E?

Companies are going series G, series F. People go really deep down because people don't go down bad. People don't like people don't like going public. It's a hassle.

They don't want to deal with the SEC. They don't want to deal.

What do you What do you think about if if if Stripe uh stripe stays private forever?

Johnny Callison. No, people don't realize that he was the great right.

He was a great rightfielder for the Philadelphia home run allar game. The win.

What do you think? What do you think if a great American company stays private forever? Is that is that going to bring? I mean, we've got, you know, as one, the orange trucks that cut down all the trees. They've been private forever and they're really, really rich. Yeah. You know, some companies. I don't know. Like, I think if you're public, uh, you have to there's some slings and arrows.

You got to answer to you.

No. [laughter]

You're more likely to get talked about on that money. Keep the stocks moving. Well, it's you know when you have like a Wells Fargo and the guy comes on and he's got this like all these flowery coats. They quotes at the beginning about Lombardi the Bucks. Lombardi was always saying listen if there's a mistake there's many and then the first thing he says is like you know actually there there were these employees that did it bad and you know don't pay attention to them. It's like no in your manual. You say that you show your how do you get people how do you get people off your talking point off their talking points? I would say like the only the only things the guests that we don't like the guests that we don't uh

the worst guests are the ones that are trying to get incripted lines and and and just that's the only time that we don't like doing the show.

I I had one the other day that was doing it and I made a joke and I stopped and it was just like I said that was a joke. Now that [laughter] and the person didn't laugh and went right on the talking points.

I interviewed Jensen and he says he's doing a talking but he's saying something and and I I I make a joke

and he doesn't say anything and I said by the way that was a joke. He goes, "Yo, I was laughing on the inside." Boom. See that guy can do it all. He [laughter] can do it all. He is just What do you do with a guy who's lovable

and you're trying to be tough? You're trying to be tough. You really want to nail him, you know? was like then he's just charming.

Charming is the enemy. Look, look, talking points and charm are those are the like the soul and caribus that we have to really avoid, right?

Funny story with Jensen. Uh we were in uh we were in DC and we were sitting there talking with Shane Copelan from Poly Market who has a partnership with ICE and Jensen came in and and and Shane goes, "Hey, I'm I'm uh uh uh I'm hey, good to meet you." Like and he's like Jensen's like, "Oh, what are you doing?" He's like, "I'm the CEO of Poly Market." And Jensen doesn't he doesn't know it. And Shane afterwards he's like, "Ah, I got to work harder. I got to work harder."

That's him. [laughter] He gets it at four. He does the emails and now he probably sets it at 3:45 and checks all the things he doesn't know that are rel too.

Uh, no. 3:45.

But [laughter] who's counting?

He gets up.

He gets up 15 minutes after you. I'm supposed to get up after 15 minutes before sending an email. What have you gotten done so far?

Wait, do you genetically just need less sleep?

Yeah. What's going on? How is this possible?

Well, you

cuz there's a hand. It's like some 5% of the population can just thrive on like 4 hours.

Okay. Well, here's Okay. So, because I'm We're not on air. I'll tell you what the things I take. Um, so I take Clonopin, I take I [laughter] take melatonin, and I take a gummy, and I can't stay asleep. See, it's it has to do with staying asleep. How much more do I take? I can't all like illegal substances to some degree. Now, they're actually control substances, but I I I that's what I do to be able to stay asleep to quarter of.

So, it's more about trying to stay asleep. It's trying to stay asleep as long as you know what time it is. I went to bed seven minutes ago. I got to get I get this picture.

You have your Apple Watch set up with like different alerts pictures of my wife.

What about What about uh when the markets are moving? That's great. That's wedding pictures making some sauce.

Yeah. Yeah. That's great.

Whoa.

Oh, it's my wife.

Yeah.

Incredible. Incredible.

She doesn't watch anything that I do. Tell us drives me crazy.

Tell us about the book.

What was the process like?

The book The book was about uh trying to get it so that people could let's say listen to you

and say, you know what, these guys really seem to like so and so. I'll go on chat. I'll go on Gemini 3. I'm going to learn about it and maybe I own a share. Right now that's stretch and verboten. People feel if you if you do more than own an index fund, you're you know, you don't know what you're doing. I come back and say the information is never easier to find. All these people who believe only in index funds are just dogmatists and what really you should be able to do is do index fund and do side by side or otherwise we just think you know what all that information that you guys put out doesn't mean anything and it can't be like that. We can't make people feel stupid. It's not right. If you have an observation that you think that a company that was on your show really knows what it's talking about. Why can't you do the research look at the website and buy a share? Why is that heresy? portfolio allocation, too. Take 10 take 10% of your assets and invest in things that you're interested in.

Do you know how much resistance I've gotten on this? Well, the alleged tour because I don't really want a tour, but I did some. I I you know, people say, "Jim, you you say that they people should own individual stocks, but over and over again, it's been proven that that's stupid." And I said, like I I was I worked with private wealth. I've seen people make tens of millions of dollars. So what we end up doing, we have a millionaire's lunch with Jensen every firefighters, police, people who listened, you know, some of them were because because I named my dog Nvidia. [laughter]

Yeah. Well, that's that worked out actually was pretty a lot of people got it was dollar at 90 when it was

and I told I said they said I told Jensen he says no one knows me. What's going on? So you know I'm like doing this. It's like I got you back. Now he's at the top.

Yeah. I got you back. I got you back. And I said, "Listen, I just came back from California. I got to tell you, I had this dog named Everest. Uh-uh. No more. The dog is Nvidia." And that's said, you know, there was a police officer who came to the show. He goes, "Look,

I bought I'm a a millionaire. I bought Nvidia." I said, "When?" He goes, "When when you you named your dog?" I said, "Do you know really kind of what it does?" He goes, "Well, you named your dog. You don't name your dog after something if you think it's a fly by night thing." Boom. Right. That's an [laughter] amazing.

Can I stay on forever? I wish we would chewing up.

I think it's your people. Look at these people. These people is an ugly sweater day, too.

I guess investor, you know. Why can't you get 2.2 yards? You're a That's what he's a Let's make this a regular thing. This was I would love, you know, honestly, you guys are what I hope would occur. Okay? I kind of always hoped that this would occur, but I didn't know who would do it. This would occur, meaning a sophisticated show, but that didn't take yourselves too seriously or I could learn. And it hadn't occurred

until you. Thank you.

And I was almost like I always thought, what did people they have to just make trillions? They can't stop and have some fun and tell us things. But you came. You happened. and the fact that you happened. I Okay, I'm going to be the only time I want to be a little immodest. I'd like to think that maybe in some way you happened cuz like somebody sometime you saw me. I think that you are

you're not 2.0. You're you're so generous. But I just feel like that you

that it occurred and that people you're another reason why the

you're on our Mount Rushmore media.

There's four of them.

But you're the biggest. [laughter]

Why? Thank you.

Good luck to you guys. Keep doing what you're doing. You're just You're just electric.

There we go.

Right. [laughter] Where am I? Where is that?

All right. Go get him. Thank you so much coming in. Alert. Alert. [laughter]

Let me tell you about linear. Read the system for software development. Linear streamlines work across the entire development cycle from road map to release. Let me also tell you about profound. Get your brand mentioned in chat. GPT. reach millions of consumers who use AI to discover new products and brands. Our next guest is Eric Lyman from Ramp from the Ramp Business Corporation.

Uh what an electric moment. What a fun time.

A goat.

Yeah, he's a goat. He's a goat. He's a fantastic uh performer. Uh he's been in front of a camera before.

He's an entertainer.

If there's ever been he's doing 10,000 hours gets you good results, it's obvious. He's doing he's this is he's doing TV at least four times today. He's doing his show three times. He popped on to our stream.

I mean he's I I mean 20 years of of Mad Money he must be he must be well past 10,000 hours on on camera.

And I think isn't it 30 years in television?

It Well, so Squawkbox has been on for 30 years. Yeah.

Uh and and Mad Money for 20 which is remarkable. Um well let me tell you about fall the generative media platform for developers develop and fine-tune models with serverless GPUs and ondemand