Gavin Baker on the SpaceX IPO, the 'token path' investment thesis, and why sovereign AI won't reach the frontier

Stock Exchange. Our next guest is the CIO and managing partner at Trades Management. You've heard him on Invest Like the Best many times, Gavin Baker. Welcome to the show. How are you doing? Doing great, man. How are you guys?

Fantastically, right? Uh SpaceX IPO. It seems like everything went just flawlessly to a tea. Like to the point where it wasn't even dramatic.

A round of applause for the banker.

The banker. It's like 20%

20% pop almost to a te.

Yeah. What what I mean by that is like is like it would have been more dramatic if it had like popped up 70% and then went down 30 and then went up 50 and it was drama, but it was just like perfect execution from start to finish. Was that how you interpreted it?

I thought Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley did a very good job.

Yeah. Um, what do you think the market is looking for SpaceX next? Is it all eyes on the first earnings report? Like where do we go from here? Because there's so much of the SpaceX story preipo that was a decade out, five years out, two years out. But is the market going to be processing quarter by quarter plays like a like many other companies? Well, I think the market is always, you know, quarters matter.

Yeah.

Um, you know, the runners on X, you know, it's like they're these reply people on X for any topic or experts.

Yeah.

But, um, somebody once told me a marathon is 26 onem runs.

Yeah.

And so, you know, and then all the runners were like, no, that's not true at all. Running, you know, obviously running a mile is different than running a marathon.

But, you know, every quarter matters. Uh but at the same time I do think if you look at how um the market has has looked at Tesla over the last five six years you know Amazon during kind of the days of you know when they were building out AWS and then um you know kind of their their retail distribution infrastructure when they'd go through these investment cycles. I do think the public market has a much greater tolerance um for investment and a much longer time horizon than a lot of people in the venture ecosystem give it credit for. By the way, this is Foxy in the back. Um he's our he's um he's one of the analysts here at a trades.

I was just listening to him on the Brad Gersonner podcast. I think you chimed in on that, right? You brought him in. There we go.

Yes, he did. But he did the work on SpaceX, so I thought you guys might want to fantastic about that. Um, but I do think that I'm not sure the story is as far out as you made it seem to be.

I think there are two variables that are going to matter a lot over the next year.

Mhm.

The first is just how quickly can they bring on terrestrial compute.

Yeah.

It does seem like they monetize gigawatts at a higher rate than anyone else.

Yeah.

And we know from Jensen that they bring on data centers faster.

Yeah.

Than anyone else per Jensen's words. Yeah.

Um and everyone in the ecosystem is really incented to get um land and power in the hands of people who can energize it because everybody starts making more money when the GPUs are energized. Um so you know if they can what what are what was the altimeter figure for how what they were monetizing gigawatts at Foxy? Do you remember for which deal? Well, I think it was like two to three, wasn't it? Like at least two times higher than like average NeoCloud pricing and that's partly in due to scale and customer quality and things like that. But it was meaningful.

Yeah. So they're doing 50 billion a gigawatt on the Google deal.

Wow.

So how quickly they can add gigawatts really matters.

Yeah.

Right. If you can energize two, three, four gawatts

Yep.

in the next year.

That's a lot of revenue. Now you know that prices may go up, they may go down, but that's really going to matter.

So all eyes on Colossus 3, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, 10, etc. At least in the short.

Yeah. Our macro hard, macro harder, macro hardested

to that. Yeah. Macro hardest.

Yeah.

Um

and then I think cursor is another big variable. Yeah. Um, you know, we we talked about it with Brad about how composer 2.5 after three weeks of, you know, RL and supervised fine-tuning Colossus 2 is kind of paro dominant. So, what's going to happen when it's applied to a bigger, better base model? Um, I do think Cursor being in, you know, half the Fortune 500

is interesting. So, I think those two things, you know, while I mean, I'm super excited for going to Mars and asteroid mining and

yeah,

and you know, a city and mass drivers on the moon, like all that stuff is awesome and I think there's a, you know, decent chance it happens in my lifetime. I just think there is there's much more tangible near-term drivers here.

Yeah. How do you think about the tension of the cloud business versus their own application and and model business? Uh I think a lot of people were surprised when the initial anthropic deal happened purely because uh knowing Michael Truel, he would have been very excited.

That's my compute.

Yeah. Yeah. Get access, hey, you got to share the only child around here.

And and it feels like uh you can imagine SpaceX, you know, bringing on a lot more compute very quickly. Uh but at the same time, every lab has had to go through this tension of like how much how much compute do we allocate to training versus inference.

A way to interpret that is that maybe the team at SpaceX is pretty confident in their ability to bring gigawatts online.

Yeah, that makes sense.

And the altimeter figure that they've ordered 20% of the Reuben's and the Reuben is an epic chip. Like Blackwell, it was really hard to get it online. Ruben is kind of a more drop in replacement.

It's a really really good chip. You'll have the um you know the Grock LPUs integrated at some point in the next six nine months.

Um

so one way to interpret that is they're pretty confident that they can bring data centers online pretty quickly. Um, but I also I I don't remember all all of the details, but I do think there there was an out in the anthropic agreement that

if they and the Google and the Google

D could be short-term Google and that's that's what I just meant. It's like it is there is like a tension there where if you you know there's a moment where maybe you want the compute but you don't necessarily have all of the revenue yet and so you could see Anyways, I'm I'm very confident we can figure it out.

Yeah. on on the topic of like Elon Web Services, is there a world where uh SpaceX winds up building out more of what looks like AWS? Like we've seen between OpenAI and Anthropic, there's this tension of like you got to be on AWS because it or you know the ecosystem or enterprises just want to be on AWS. They won't even go over to Azure or Google Cloud for whatever. And you could imagine like it might is it enough to just be a token factory or do you need to have you know a database and an in-memory storage and you know cloud storage and cold storage and all the things that ABS provides.

My thought is that being a token factory is more than enough for the next 5 to 10 years man we are

yeah we need more token factories. Um but we'll we'll see and if they need that stuff like they will build it.

Yeah. How are you thinking about the other hyperscalers, the other big tech companies? Uh we we were sort of puzzling over uh Meta's strategy at this point. Tons of resources, cash flow, data centers. They have experience there. Maybe they're not as fast as as SpaceX, but there's a lot there, but it's a completely different motion to go into token factory. Um and yet there's still a lot of demand. So, how do you think all of that plays out?

Well, I think there's many ways to go into the token factory business. You could, if you're if you're Meta,

yeah,

you could just say to someone like Fireworks, um,

hey,

here are 100,000 GPUs. We'll we'll take a revenue split and we'll see what happens.

Y

um

I am increasingly looking at EV to net PP&E as a valuation metric. Just with the idea being installed, atoms on Earth, I think are going to appreciate in value. This is a little bit that halo trade that um I think maybe Goldman Sachs came up with, you know, high asset value, low obsolescence.

Yeah.

But Meta, you know, Meta's EV to net PP&E multiple is in an interesting place. It just suggests that the market has an immense amount of skepticism

about their ability to monetize their own asset base. And and I think that's I think that's warranted given that all we've really got out of management is this concept of personal super intelligence.

And it would be different if Meta AI was like at the top of the app store and everyone you were talking to was like yeah you know I'm using Meta AI

where there even there was like a killer feature within Instagram. It's like oh people are shopping in Instagram now.

And I think no one no one doubts that like once Zuck has an AI product with a billion dollars of revenue he can take it to to tens of billions. But it's unclear I feel like you know going into enterprise like you know what is this API business going to going to look like we know they can use the GPUs just on making the ads product better at the end of the day and um

but there's a lot of questions

look I think a few things I do think it if I look at the way different players are behaving it feels like everyone thinks we're entering the endg game. Everybody, you know, loves to use these chess analogies and it looks like the endgame may be here sooner than we think. I think that's why OpenAI is cutting codeex pricing

simply because coding, you know, coding tokens are so valuable

and if you don't have enough of them, you may not be able to get into this RSI loop that that everyone is, you know,

pushing for. Um, and I I think if you're Zuckerberg, you feel that acutely. I thought Muse, what are the

Muse Spark?

It it was to me it was an upside surprise and it made me feel like, you know, what's the uh what's what's what's from Tallaladega Nights or what is it? So, you're saying there's a chance.

Oh, yeah.

Like, yeah. So, you're telling me there's a chance? Um,

I mean the other quote from Tallaladega Nights is if you're not your f if you're not first, you're last.

And and you know

that's how a lot of

there's so many good quotes from Tallaladega Nights.

The windshield.

Yeah. 100%. But I think if um I'm pretty confident Mark Zuckerberg has proven to be a good entrepreneur over time and has been willing to pivot, you know, and it's just it's so funny, you know, right now Facebook has, you know, Meta has tell investors there's like no chance that we're going to, you know, you know, monetize GPUs externally. Well, like 10 days before they announced all those layoffs. Um, which I think it was at the end of 22, if not I don't remember when they started to announce the layoffs. It was short shortly after Brad, maybe at two months after Brad wrote that letter to Mark where he said, "You're the king. You can do whatever you want, but this what I might respectfully encourage you to do." Um, you know, they went from saying, "We're not going to do that. we're gonna keep investing to, you know, super focused on OPEX in a couple of days, man. So, it's like people they meet with Meta and they hear, "Oh, you know, we're not um we're not going to monetize our GPUs externally." Well, I don't know, check back in a few hours.

Yeah. Yeah. No, it's like everyone it comes down to like everyone has a price. You look at you look at Elon and Anthropic's relationship 4 months ago uh and then you look at kind of kind of as the opportunity unfolded

it made sense for them to partner. I wanted to ask how

on the meta thing I think there is one point that's important what ultimately drives behavior for all these big cap companies like getting to AI I think that does feel um existential for all of them but the stock price also really matters

because if you don't if the stock goes down you know you gave people a grant at this price stock goes down you know your engineers are unhappy and it's tougher to get to where you want to go if you don't have you know these you know Well, forget the 10x engineer. People are talking about the 10,000x engineer.

You know, you're not going to get there if you don't keep those 10,000x engineers.

Yeah.

So, just I think

like we'll see. We'll see with Meta.

Yeah.

Yeah. Uh how did this IPO uh update your your general kind of framework for the role that retail is playing in capital markets? Uh a lot of uh it was very funny last week to see people like uh say like oh that the IPO is only 2x overs subscribed by retail all these other you know three billion dollar IPOs were we're 10x overs subscribed and it's like no we're we're talking about you know a very you know order of magnitude difference here but it still feels like retail is going to

play a very very important role over the next 12 months maybe more so than ever given that the the the the hyperscalers are are now running um you know cash flow negative. You have the conflict in the Middle East, right? There's rebuilding efforts that needs to needs to happen. And so I feel like retail this is this is kind of um retail's moment now maybe more than ever.

Yeah. Well, so a few things. One, people say retail in a porative way, and I would just say stupid is stupid does. And like you know we track you know there's all these indices of retail favorites and man they're up a lot and they're up a lot 25 and they're up a lot in 24

you know so kind of stupid is a stupid does. So I'm not um you know like I think retail is probably outperforming the overwhelming majority of professional money managers whether they're you know private equity managers venture

you know public equity managers whatever. So like retail, I don't think it's pjorative. I do actually think in the case of um

SpaceX, I'm not sure, you know, you process so much information. I'm not sure where this comes from, but I actually think after the IPO, um you know, for whatever reason, it some of that retail stock may have may have gotten allocated to people who were flipping it because my understanding is there was more institutional buying. I don't know where this after the IPO there was retail buying. Huh. Now, I'm sure you know retail is very sensitive to momentum. So, maybe what's happening today changes that. But I think another really underappreciated thing about the SpaceX IPO is that 10 over 10,000 SpaceX employees bought on the IPO. And that's just, you know, everybody does all these lockup analyses and oh, how much stock is going to come come to market and, you know, for sure there's all these triple layer SPVS or whatever, you know, or maybe there are there are people speculate there are um and I'm sure some of that will get unwound,

but the reality is is that SpaceX employees own a lot of this. And if you're an employee or even if you're an investor who has an S an SPV or you're directly on the cap table, you've had a chance to sell every six months for the last 10 years.

If you wanted to sell, you could have sold and you know whatever when they did that offering in in the second half of last year.

Yeah.

So I think the supply demand dynamics here are going to be very interesting. But with retail in in general, um, yeah, man, they're they've been a more powerful force in the market over the last three and a half years than at any other time in my career, including the year 2000 bubble, which I think this is nothing like, by the way.

Um, but yeah, they matter and stupid is and stupid does. Uh I'm interested to go a click deeper on the idea of like value will acrue to companies that are in the token path. I think that phrase is uh extremely powerful right now. But I want to sort of expand it and understand the fringes of the token path because uh we talked to Matthew Prince at Cloudflare stocks at all-time highs. It's delivering tokens at the edge and obviously there's an immense amount of AI agents that are interfacing with different websites. They need to be distributed. So there's a lot of value there. But is Cloudflare in the token path if they're the one finally sending you the packet of tokens at the edge

or does that not count? How does that how do you think about that?

Every CDN has has this business. You know they signed

Yeah. What was it a$ 1.8 billion dollar with anthropic and if you have all these points of presence Yeah.

and you can deliver really low latency tokens to highv value users.

I think what's interesting for for cloud for all these CDNs

Yeah.

is they're they're getting a massive premium for that latency.

Yeah.

You know it turns out you know one of the lessons from from Cerebrus is people are willing to pay for speed.

Yeah.

And you see that in the prices these guys are commanding. But I do think I mean my gut is in terms of tokens consumed um on planet earth these CDNs are delivering less than 1% of them and I mean maybe less than 10 basis points

they're all most of the tokens they're happening internally and then you just get the result.

Um

would I say that these guys are in the token path? I mean I would say they have a path towards being in the token path. Yeah. And they have part of their they have part of their business that's in it today.

Yeah.

And they're trying and like everyone they're trying to move it more and more there.

Yeah. Yeah. I mean uh Matthew was talking about uh h colllocating Nvidia servers on the edge specifically for the delivery of voice models because you want those to be very low latency. Maybe you want your coding model to go off and cook in Virginia for 20 minutes or an hour and then come back to you with the final result. But uh if you're trying to actually talk to a model, you probably want it as fast as possible. What about on the opposite end?

Wasn't there that startup that Nvidia just invested in that like will

Oh, yeah. On your house.

Money

that put a GPU, you know, four a four GPU server on the outside of your house. I mean,

yeah.

GPUs are going everywhere, going in your bed eventually.

I mean, it's full circle, too.

Wasn't Jensen talking about stuff like that back during like the original crypto cycle being like everyone's going to be, you know, mining?

Yeah. Yeah, I mean the the Tesla Power Wall is like a version of that for storing energy. It doesn't store compute, but it stores energy locally on the edge off the grid and uh there's a lot of powerful things that get unlocked by that. What about land? Is land in the token path at some point on the extreme other end? Uh because people are obviously searching for go going further and further upstream. They found a a toilet company that makes a particular material that goes into semiconductor supply chain. People are hunting for like the final the final ingredient. Maybe it's just sand that turns into silicon.

Yeah, I do think the bottleneck bros as they are called are

this like bottleneck trade is kind of nearing its end.

Okay.

And you know I did um you know the Wall Street Journal had the story about this Japanese company that makes um I forget what they make. It's atood. Yeah. Aimoto. Um, and you know, everybody's in this because they thought they were going to raise prices and then they just said, "We're actually not going to raise prices. This is the wrong thing for us." And I almost posted yesterday on X, welcome to Japan to all of the uh bottleneck people.

But, you know, everybody's, you know, having claw run, what's the next bottleneck?

Yeah,

that was that was the game for the last year. The next game is what has enduring franchise value.

Yeah. kind of on the other side of these bottlenecks whenever whenever that is

as far as land. Is land a bottleneck? Man, I do think the math for orbital compute to me it once they can reuse Starship.

Yeah,

I think the math for orbital compute becomes pretty compelling. You know, it's just 60 billion to bring on a gig terrestrially. 25 is power and cooling. You don't need that in space. And so the right comp for that 35 billion of kind of you know IT equipment GPU, CPU, switches um you know memory, storage um is is that 25 billion versus the cost of launch. And once Starship is reusable, I think the cost of launch is 5 billion. So 20 that means you can put a gig into space for 30 billion and a gig on Earth is 60 billion. And that 25 the power and cooling feels reasonably inflationary to me.

Sure.

Um so I don't know that I would say land is in the tokens token path.

Maybe beachfront property but that's about it.

Yeah. Beachfront property is beachfront property. Airplanes. Yeah.

Really nice cars.

Yep. Firmly in the token path.

All that stuff is in the token path.

I gotcha. uh how do you think the events of of last week with Anthropic and DC update uh different countries on their own sovereign AI play because there's been there's been attempts it doesn't feel like you know many of the attempts have you know you can have a powered shell and you can have the best GPUs but if you don't have the talent it's really it's going to be really hard to get to the frontier and now if you don't have massive usage it'll also be really hard to get to the frontier and So, do you think the ship has sailed?

No. Well, look, look, I think every country is going to want to have their own sovereign AI strategy at a minimum for national defense. I think where that ends up is um I saw today that the EU had restricted exports of Mstral's lat.

I think that's a joke. I think that's a meme. So people have gone so far on the MR leashhat thing that that they're saying it's like mythos is distilled on it and it's breaking all the benchmarks. I think it's a good model but I don't know that it's quite there yet.

Yeah.

But you can imagine that we get there for sure.

Yeah. Yeah. So, I think what sovereign AI will look like for essentially all countries really other than the United States and and China, although I think China is going to fall further and further behind

is just some sort of you do you use um you know, you use one of these providers to do some reinforcement learning on your language, your culture, your values.

Um you have a system prompt. um you do some supervised fine-tuning and you run that on whatever the best open source model is. I think that's where sovereign AI ends up and then you run it in your own data centers so you feel like you know it's safe and whatever defense questions you're asking it or whatever forget questions whatever defense and intelligence um and maybe um you know policing activities your sovereign AI agents are doing you know 24 hours a day you feel like they're safe.

Yeah. So I think that's where sovereign AI ends up and I think you know there'll still be a big buildout for that but man sovereign AI at the frontier I don't see it.

Yeah. What do you think the drivers are of the widening gap between Chinese open source models and American closed source models is?

China has made a terrible mistake not you know taking it feels like the administration has been willing to let them buy H200s or P30s.

Oh yeah. And I think they're on this like, you know, they have this crazy belief that, oh, you know, our own internal chips are good enough. They're not.

Yeah.

And then, you know, I think what's making them think that is that Chinese labs are very, very good at distillation. Somebody told me it only took 160,000 reasoning traces

from 013 to get the original Deep Seek. you know, they're very clever at industrial scale distillation, running it through multiple APIs,

pinging each API from, you know, we've all seen those iPhone farms in China. You know, they've got they've got the same thing for distillation and they've got, you know, 100,000 endpoints distilling these models across every API available. They've gotten really really good at that, but man, all that goes away if people stop releasing these models at the frontier. And I think mythos is a side of things to come there.

Yeah. Yeah. It seems like they're getting much better at locking down the reasoning traces, locking down the the espionage. It feels like uh back during the L1 days, the labs weren't even aware that distillation was so possible that that was uh that that was something that was such a such a potential threat. For sure.

Jordan, please.

Is any part of you worried that you'll never see another another company like SpaceX? Um, worried is the wrong word.

Not not worried. Not worried, but but like you have to appreciate you have to appreciate that a moment like that you it's possible that you have an opportunity to invest in a company like that one time in your career. And thank God you did it because there's plenty of people that that had the opportunity and didn't. And uh

well

well I did own 15% of Nvidia when it was a sub$2 billion market cap but and I own 10% of Tesla when it was a sub$2 billion market cap. Um but um but SpaceX certainly it's been a special experience for me

and I think there is a chance that it is you know one of the most important iconic companies of all time. I mean it already is. Uh maybe there's a chance it's the most. Um and I think in general it's just like I I kind of want to take a step back and like all this trillionaire hate from the left. It's like the you know there was a great post from my friend um Kevin Mafy saying like oh this is a bond villain who's decarbonizing the world. Last time I checked, people on the left

were like the environment

connecting u you know poor people in low-income countries, schools and hospitals to the internet at very low cost and he's helping blind people see today and you know interact with the world. That's a villain. Um and then just like there's so many parts of the SpaceX story like all of the you know blueco collar workers who've gotten super wealthy. uh if you're opposed to data centers on Earth because the environment, well, SpaceX is your is your solution. So, um you know, there was another great post that just said, you know, the left won and they don't even appreciate it. The world's first first trillionaire,

you know, has done more to kind of solve the environment than like everyone else on Earth combined.

Y

I saw there was another good one. It's like, yeah, Elon could solve world hunger by, you know, market selling every, you know, uh, piece of stock that he has and send the world into a global economic downturn, losing, you know, millions of millions of jobs in the process.

Yeah. That somebody said that Elon that the World Bank could solve hunger with five billion. And he and he said, "If you prove it to me, I'll do it."

Yeah, of course.

And turns out you can't solve world hunger for $5 billion.

Yeah. Um, but yeah, SpaceX is certainly I would say, you know, SpaceX, Nvidia, Tesla, they've all been very special to me in in kind of a different way, but man, there is nothing like a rocket launch. And so, I just don't think has a visceral experience. I highly recommend everyone listening, you guys, if you have kids, take your kids to a lodge. You don't want to go with SpaceX. Everybody's always like, "Oh, get me the special tickets." You just literally you could go to a beach at Bokh Chica. Yeah.

And be where the special SpaceX viewing area is. You can literally be closer to the lodge. Yeah.

You could there's hotels near Vandenberg. Take your kids

see a lodge. It's super inspirational that humans are capable of this and it's much more visceral than you realize.

You know, the sound, the blast of hot air, a lot of people cry. So, go see a launch. But there will be a ne never I don't think a I'm pretty skeptical that there will be another um company that delivers a visceral experience like that. And then listen, if SpaceX puts a city on on the moon and then Mars and enables, you know, becomes the British East Indian company, the solar system, I think this will and those there's a lot of hard engineering that needs to happen to go into all that. this will probably be the most important company um of certainly my lifetime of maybe maybe of all time. Um and so from that sense I don't think there will ever be anything else like it. And yeah, I guess that is a little bit sad but you know what there's so much awesome stuff happening in the world that it's it's it's tough for me to get too down there.

I love it.

Yeah. Hard hard to hard to be hard to be too

I have I have one last question. We have uh um you mentioned owning Nvidia sub2 billion. What is the health of the sub2 billion uh market right now? Is there is there anything that you're excited about?

Is there anything that the bottleneck bros haven't ran up haven't run up to a billion?

Bros have taken everything under two billion a maybe not even maybe not even uh like uh like public companies but private areas. is I mean we're starting to see the knock-on effects of AI in bio and uh material science and like neuralink was sub 2 billion for a long time right and so there are more like not in theme but accelerated by so I don't know there's also just like

company

there's loads of incredible venture companies you know startups under two billion yeah um

like loads of them um you know I I I I talked watching them, you know, several times a week minimum.

Yeah.

In public, you know, until the bottleneck bros came along, until AI came along, there was not a lot happening in public small cap land. Yeah.

And by the way, on this like all these small caps, these bottlenecks, this AI, it does feel a little weird to me that you could have like a large following on social media, post about, you know, buy buy stock at something.

Yeah.

And then post about, you know, outline your thesis in a $35 million market cap company and send it up like a thousand%. Um, and there's a lot of that going on. And by the way, this not this is not like a serenity comment. I think that guy's that person

is smart,

but I mean there's there's there's there's a lot of shady stuff happening it feels like to me.

Sure.

Well, yeah. And it's you look back at uh you know you were a young uh young analyst at at Fidelity right during the the doc you know the end of the the dotcom cycle and there was a lot of just like euphoria stuff happening and in the years that followed there was consequences right there there were people ultimately had to to face um

sometimes civil penalties all sorts of different things companies went bankrupt there were all sorts of different uh you know perturbations in the kid. And of course, we got a co we got a bunch of really enduring generational companies through that period, too.

Although a lot of these accounts are anonymous, and I'm sure they're logged into social media with a madeup email.

Yeah.

You know, gone through a VPN. And so,

I don't I don't know. We'll see.

It is different than a research than a sellside research report that maybe goes a little bit too far, but there's still a whole compliance department around it. Uh we are in Yeah. uncharted territory. So, uh, everyone needs to stay safe out there and do your own research, I suppose.

Yeah.

Anyway,

well, guys, man, this was super fun.

This was great. Let's do it again soon.

Come on more.

Thank you so much.

Anytime. Let's get the whole team on, too.

Yeah. You know what? That's actually fun.

Let's do that with the whole team.

That' be amazing.

Awesome.

I would love it. Yeah. Yeah. You got a conference conference room with a with a nice wide angle camera. You can just have the whole crew there. That's great. Partner into a partner meeting. Exactly. Awesome. Great to hang with you guys. Have a great rest of your day. Thank you so much for coming on. We'll talk to you soon. Let me tell you about CrowdStrike.