Gstaad Guy on why AI will widen the luxury divide: 'The optimized will become more optimized, and the exclusive more exclusive'

Speaker 1: Codex helps you move projects forward from start to finish. Our next guest is here live with us in the TBPN UltraDome. Here's Sean Bennett. Welcome to the show. How are you doing? Good to see you.

Speaker 2: Made

Speaker 1: it. Thanks so much for coming on down to Hollywood to the TBPN UltraDome.

Speaker 9: Thank you for having me.

Speaker 1: Why don't you introduce yourself for those who maybe are living under a data center?

Speaker 9: I'm the Gstaad guy. Yes. I make videos sometimes in character. Yeah. Saturizing some of the absurd lifestyles

Speaker 2: Yeah.

Speaker 9: That exist around the world.

Speaker 1: Longer a creator, you're the CEO of a media company. Is that how do you think about yourself now?

Speaker 2: Talent and operator.

Speaker 1: Operator. Right? Because you have a team, I assume.

Speaker 9: I do. Do. I think that's the case for many creators right now. And I think the reason why people started using the media company term is because Mhmm. They felt insulted by the term creator. I actually feel celebrated by it, so influencer. Influencer. Influencer was like a slur. Slur.

Speaker 1: Yeah. Exactly. And then they're like, maybe creative's a little bit nicer, being creative's good, but Yeah. What what is it

Speaker 2: it it is an important point because I know creators that like they desperately they're like, I don't wanna be seen as a creator. I wanna be seen as a CEO. I wanna be seen as a business owner. Founder. And then and then there's actually the level above that which is like, no, I actually enjoy. I think we both experience having companies and then doing this. Yeah. Like, just being being talent and being the host is the thing that I feel like I'm best at. Yep. I got I'm pretty okay at building companies Yeah. And running companies and managing people. Yeah. But it's not the thing that I enjoy as much as just hanging out and talking with John

Speaker 1: It's way more fun.

Speaker 2: Fun the people in our And so, I think a lot of those people, hopefully, they'll get to come around and be like, actually, no. I I like just making the thing that is the business.

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 2: Yeah. All of the One of the thing yeah. One of the reasons I was excited to have you on the show is that in the same way that you use humor to talk about these sort of like lifestyles and consumption and Basically, like we started doing this in character in the most like sort of insane version of in in the case of of for us, was like Tech Bros. Right? Or we started the show, it was called Technology Brothers before we realized like, hey, maybe there's something bigger But we were being like like, oh, at at times, like, maybe too humorous about a bunch of different

Speaker 1: It was a satire on the quiet luxury trend in Silicon Valley. We called it loud opulence.

Speaker 2: Wanted to

Speaker 1: be as loud and over the top as possible, and sort of like poke fun at the fact that there's so many people in San Francisco that are extremely wealthy and they're like, I drive a Prius. And it's like, what do you drive on the weekend? He's like, no, you got a Koenigsegg in the

Speaker 2: But but sometimes it takes sometimes it takes somebody willing to just lean into humor and and to actually tell the truth Yeah. About certain things. Yeah. Thank

Speaker 9: you. I appreciate the the compliments.

Speaker 2: It's Yeah.

Speaker 9: It's fun.

Speaker 2: But yeah, think I think Yeah. Where should we start? Maybe a review of Euro Summer. Do you how do you rate it the swing? How do you rate the last quarter?

Speaker 1: Is overblown at this point?

Speaker 9: I I think Euro Summer is still on for those for those of who can can be in that position to have it still be on. But Euro summer, I think, ends in October.

Speaker 6: Okay. So we'll have to be back.

Speaker 2: We're in

Speaker 1: the fall.

Speaker 2: We're in the the final days.

Speaker 9: Yeah. We're in the we're in the final days. Think mid mid October starts to slow down. Yeah. I mean, don't forget, many people who live in Europe are professional consumers. Sure. They don't work much

Speaker 1: Mhmm.

Speaker 9: And they've learned the ways of summering Yeah. Through generations.

Speaker 2: Yes.

Speaker 9: It's not a it's not a, oh, I'll do this when I make it. It's actually a, I grew up doing this.

Speaker 2: Mhmm.

Speaker 9: Yep. And that's, I think, where a lot of the humor comes from and a lot of the judgment comes from

Speaker 2: Yeah.

Speaker 9: Where some of the people that you interview or even

Speaker 1: Sure.

Speaker 9: Poke fun at on the show, that's who they feel judged by because they make a lot of money, they go to Europe for the first time, they sometimes make the wrong spending decisions

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 9: Because what they thought was cool is maybe not so cool.

Speaker 2: Yeah. No, that's the thing when you when you Sure. If you're in a family that has been very successful for generations, the the next gen, the younger generation is effectively judging each other based on how they are consuming. Mhmm. Like, that that is in a here, at least in within within our networks, Yeah. It's like the judgment is like, well, what company are you building? Are you are you the category are you the category leader? How much money have you raised? How big is your team? Like Yeah. Specifically with like, you know, the people that are on the show. In Europe, it's like, you know, it's it's what watch are you wearing, but not not like how much money did you spend on it, but how unique is it and what is like the history behind it and do you know the watchmaker and how much time have you spent here or there and where, you know, not just I mean I mean, it just goes on and on and on, and and I appreciate it. I was I was I took a a driving trip to to Austria recently, and like there's I feel like I'm getting better at at spending money and I've always liked No. I'm just saying I've always I've always liked I've always liked consumption. Yeah. Yeah. I I've always I've just always enjoyed it. Like most

Speaker 9: of us have.

Speaker 2: And I I've always liked You think

Speaker 1: you were bad

Speaker 2: at

Speaker 1: it?

Speaker 2: I certainly have been bad at Okay. Like, I when I when I talk about being bad at consumption it's like you buy something and you regret the purchase. Okay. Yeah. Because your maybe your taste level Yeah. Increased like

Speaker 1: You bought something that expensive.

Speaker 2: Yeah. Even as a kid I bought Yeah. A certain like piece of snowboarding gear. Then I realized like a month later, well, I shouldn't have bought that because this other thing is actually Sure. Sure. Okay. Really want.

Speaker 9: And listen, I think that's generally a good thing.

Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 9: Yeah. In the category of people who can afford to do so, think those who aren't very good at consuming aren't very good because they're busy producing. Yeah. And that's like, macroeconomically, it's kind of what's happening right now.

Speaker 2: Sure.

Speaker 9: Yeah. People in The US are making a whole lot more than most in Europe, and when they take their fourteen days off or for some, let's say slightly more, they ball out and they they make a big splash. Yes. And then these resorts like Saint Tropez, for example, actually rely on The US consumer who comes in for fourteen days and goes crazy.

Speaker 1: Interesting.

Speaker 9: Meanwhile, a European consumer gets average twenty eight days off a year. Yeah. So literally twice as much. Yeah. And they're making at least half as much. Yeah. Yeah. So they actually need to make the dollar go a lot further.

Speaker 2: Yeah.

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 9: While you, you're in Austria, you're you can ball out.

Speaker 2: Well, yeah. But what I what I appreciate is that, like, the friends that I was with were, going to the hole in the wall place that they'd been for Mhmm. Going to for twenty years at this point. And it's not for them, it's not at all about how much money can you spend even if they could theoretically spend just as much as the sort of like, you know, American going crazy for two What it's about.

Speaker 1: Yeah. How do businesses in Centurpay actually price discriminate? Is it like, okay, we know this is when American summer will be here, so let's raise prices? Is it just there are more expensive things on the menus? And so we know that the Americans will will gravitate towards that. Like, what what strategies do you see where you're like, oh, this is a sharp business operator? They're both keeping the European clientele happy when they're in town, but then they're also extracting max value from the Americans who are there?

Speaker 9: I think for the most part, a great case study for this is hotels.

Speaker 1: Okay.

Speaker 9: Because I think if restaurants play with prices

Speaker 1: Mhmm.

Speaker 9: It's usually not a very good restaurant. Yeah. It's usually very gimmicky.

Speaker 1: Yep.

Speaker 9: Or more like a club or like a beach club. Sure. Which no one I think goes to consistently. Yeah. I think anyone who goes to like a party setting beach club and sprays champagne

Speaker 1: Yep.

Speaker 9: Does it once or twice On as like a festive occasion Mhmm. To celebrate the moment. But then when they go back Mhmm. They go with their fiance or their wife and it's more modest and they're drinking wine instead of spraying champagne. So I think Yeah. Those occasion based restaurants would actually forget them in this conversation.

Speaker 1: Sure.

Speaker 9: For hotels, think it's just pure supply and demand. Sure. I think there's a few hotels that offer exceptional experiences and every year there's more people generating insane amounts of wealth and Yeah. Wanting to vacation there for a few years and they just raise the prices as much as they can.

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 9: Some hotels though stay very loyal to the consumer you were talking about that has been staying with them for years Yeah. And that values the substance more than the status

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 9: Of that place. And the hotel loves that. And they may not be necessarily owned by a big group or a publicly traded hospitality group where they actually need to have crazy growth every year, they can just sustain. Mhmm.

Speaker 2: Yeah. How do you it feels like one of the ways that you select for the more discerning generational client is like, you make things like less Instagram friendly Mhmm. Than they maybe could. Right? So you could have a hotel that has incredible service level, but it looks like kind of something more casual and country. Right? Versus the new hotel build that where every single moment is designed to like look really good on camera and there's good lighting and it and it feels like very like it has the aesthetics of being like very luxurious, but the service quality might actually be far worse.

Speaker 9: Mhmm.

Speaker 2: But it feels like like certain establishments now, they need to actually like not lean into that sort of generic global Instagram aesthetic.

Speaker 9: I I think it's it's less of an intention and more of an outcome, of actually something a little deeper. I think that the deeper thing is family owned versus massive group owned.

Speaker 2: Mhmm.

Speaker 9: Yeah. And these massive groups need to justify their existence, and they need to keep growing and growing and growing, and that's at the expense often of quality. And through the the method of painting things gold and having this sort of status element and making things Instagrammable, so they can market and justify their higher and higher prices. These family owned hotels, they don't care about that. They don't need the Instagram. They're sold out months in advance, sometimes years in advance, and they're just happy to exist and survive. And they can focus on the substance elements with the ingredients in the kitchen and they don't need to have the flashy things that attract people. Ultimately, really think that luxury consumers, and this is what I actually talk about in my content, sometimes out of character on my podcast or in character in my satire, but I think luxury consumption exists as a journey. And it's a journey from people jumping into this world and feeling judged and making the wrong consumption decisions and buying the wrong things and dining at the wrong places and acting the wrong way, and slowly becoming more and more discerning. And that can happen over five years or fifty years, I think it always happens.

Speaker 2: Always happens. I think it always happens.

Speaker 9: I don't I don't really know anyone who's had the financial power to consume and travel to these beautiful places for their entire life and act silly the entire time. I think they they get better and better as time goes on. And with knowledge and some judgment, they often improve faster than So you're

Speaker 1: saying there's a chance I could be the first. First person to never develop taste.

Speaker 2: Well, And it's funny because it express

Speaker 1: You know.

Speaker 2: It expresses itself in different ways like, I think like in the Alps like a Lamborghini Urus is like actually if it's specs properly can be like an incredible car.

Speaker 5: Mhmm.

Speaker 2: And when I see them in that context, I think, wow, I really wish I I like I should get one of those. But the problem is you you put it in the LA context and it's just like the Yeah. The sort of the whole thing just doesn't work. Sure. Right? Just because of the the sort of local context. Yeah. How do you what how do you see like wellness as a hospitality trend? It feels like we're still at peak wellness and maybe there's room to grow. But at the same time, I personally you know, I've had saunas and cold plunges for like probably six years now, like, at at home. And so for me when I'm traveling somewhere, like, I'm not even really that's not maybe it's like on the list of things that I think are maybe it's cool if you have a sauna at the property, but that's not like why I'm sort of like

Speaker 1: Mhmm.

Speaker 2: Moving around the world to experience these things. And it feels like a lot of people say they want those things, but when they're traveling they sometimes Yeah. Like there's a bunch of other things that are maybe more worth their time. But Mhmm. Where do you see it sort of trending?

Speaker 9: I I feel like the health and wellness thing is now nearly like the final boss

Speaker 2: Yeah.

Speaker 9: Stage of consumption Yeah. Where stage one people focus on that status I was talking about. When they first make money, they want to celebrate, it's festive, they're like, made it. I want to go party and and and show people I made it.

Speaker 1: Sure.

Speaker 9: Stage two, I think, is indulgence. They go on a of wine tours, make a ton of wine, eat a lot of caviar. And it's like still somewhat status y, but they think it's more understated.

Speaker 1: Mhmm.

Speaker 9: But it's still highly indulgent. And then eventually they get over it and they say, you know what, I bought all the cars, I got the watches, I'm over all of this. What really matters? And they dive deeper into health and wellness. And all the people I know eventually, to be honest, that have been spending for a long time, who go from flashy to understated, eventually also go to sporty, and that's the final boss.

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 9: They go from cashmere to athleisure. Yeah. Still still in cashmere.

Speaker 1: And then what's their

Speaker 2: marathon time?

Speaker 9: And then exactly. Yeah. What's their They're cycling triathlon

Speaker 1: or cycling because they wanna live forever.

Speaker 2: Exactly. Yeah. This is we were having a conversation.

Speaker 1: Ryan Johnson,

Speaker 2: we're Yeah. We were talking about for an interview that hasn't been released yet about like this sort of like tech We're a lot of Tech. No no no. It wasn't. Someone was interviewing us.

Speaker 1: Oh, Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 2: And they were asking like who we look up to and it's actually like we look up to the CEOs that don't just like have a cool car collection, but they're actually like doing motorsports at the at a high level like Yeah. Pro am level. Yeah. They're going and they're doing like

Speaker 9: It's cool.

Speaker 2: Endurance racing and things like that, where it's not like they can buy any car in the world, but it's like if you can buy any car in the world, what are you what are you doing with that? The building, right? It's like, can you keep it on the track? Can you be at these sort of iconic races and actually be fast enough to not embarrass yourself. Yeah. And that's really That's like rising up to that to that next level. Yeah. You're talking about. I think so too. I

Speaker 1: wanna talk about the characters.

Speaker 9: Sure. Please.

Speaker 1: Yeah. The the dividing line. Like, how do you think about building the portfolio of characters? You have two now.

Speaker 9: I have two.

Speaker 1: Is there gonna be a third? Is this something you're considering? Are you do you even think about it that way? And then is there how harsh is the line between you're not in character? Like, we we we have loose characters that we slip into But here and do you slip in and out of them ever? Or is it like, okay, I am producing a piece of content in this character, there's a hard line, and then I'm going to do an interview out of character and there's a hard line.

Speaker 9: Okay. I love

Speaker 2: those like in real life, you're like, who am I right now?

Speaker 9: Exactly. But I asked myself this morning. No.

Speaker 1: No. We actually had our team like text you and and be like, does he want to do it in character? Because that's fine. No. No. We just don't want to be like throwing questions at you and not be on the same page a little But you could have ambushed us. Maybe you still will.

Speaker 9: That's true. I might. Yeah. Might jump in. I'll walk you through the

Speaker 1: Yeah. Explain the characters for So

Speaker 9: characters, I have three characters. Okay. The third is just me myself, which is here, so we'll ignore that for now. Okay. The two main characters are Constance

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 9: And Colton. Yeah. Constance is everything heritage. Mhmm. He's a constant. Mhmm. He's been there a hundred years ago. Mhmm. He'll be there a hundred years in the future. Mhmm. He's the ambassador of excellence the Yes. Old world of luxury, the old world of Europe. He is old money, taste, tact, manners. Yes. He is who your grandparents wants you to be when you visit Constantin. Exactly. Constantin. He's head to toe in the finest lower piano cashmere. Yes. He's wearing the best watches. Yes. He drives understated cars. Yes. He hikes. He sails.

Speaker 1: Love it.

Speaker 9: He's chic. Yeah. Constantine. Chic. His cousin Colton

Speaker 1: Okay.

Speaker 9: Is the anti Constantine. Sorry to say it. Yeah. Yeah. Colton is everything hype. Yep. Colton is everything status

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 9: While Constance is substance. Yeah. Colton wants to follow every trend.

Speaker 2: Yep. Colton bought the Louis Vuitton singer collab.

Speaker 1: Thought that was

Speaker 2: actually pretty cool.

Speaker 9: So so and and Colton is basically the anti constants. Sure. And I use them to

Speaker 1: Show both sides.

Speaker 9: Show both sides.

Speaker 2: Yeah. Because they're occupying the same spaces.

Speaker 9: I think they're actually occupying the same mind. And that's where I was going with the account. I think there's no pure play Yep. Mean, no is a big word. There's very few pure constants

Speaker 4: Totally.

Speaker 9: Very few pure cultums.

Speaker 1: Yep.

Speaker 9: What I see happening is on a Friday night, people want to be cultum.

Speaker 1: Yep.

Speaker 9: Sunday morning Yep. They wanna play some golf and they want to be Constance. Yeah. And actually it's a push and pull of an internal dilemma

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 9: Of a wealthy consumer. Yes. And that's where I started going with the accounts where

Speaker 1: there's not a uniform judgment on both of them. Like, there might be ones more to aspire to, but there's a reality there

Speaker 9: Exactly.

Speaker 1: Between both of

Speaker 9: them. It's a fluid emotion. It's like the angel and devil on your shoulder Yeah. It's exaggerated. And I used the characters to really storytell

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 9: The what. What is driving this world? Yeah. What matters in this Stadtgai world? Yep. Through the voices of satire of Constantin Colton. The how is the manners Yeah. The tact. You don't just buy a lower piano cashmere sweater. There's a way to wear it, there's a way to celebrate it. You don't just go to Chateau Lacoste in Provence. You appreciate the art a certain way, you drink the wine a certain way.

Speaker 1: Mhmm.

Speaker 9: That's the how. Mhmm. The final step, which I noticed my audience going through, is actually the why. Everyone who would eventually enjoy these beautiful experiences would sit there and wonder, why am I even here? Yeah. Why do these clothes matter? Why do these watches matter? And that felt disrespectful to do in character.

Speaker 1: Oh, sure.

Speaker 9: Because I'm talking to hoteliers and restaurateurs

Speaker 1: Yep.

Speaker 9: And and craftsmen and and people really putting their life and passion into Yeah. Into ultimately luxuries

Speaker 2: Yeah.

Speaker 9: But with so much serious love. I had to do it as myself. Sure. So I broke character for the why. Yeah. So the what and the how, Constance and Colton in character. Okay. The why is just me here talking

Speaker 1: to you. If you want an even more insufferable term beyond influencer creator, world builder is the one that really gets people going these days. But it but it is true that shot guy is a world, and it's fascinating hearing you how they they play with each other. How much are the two characters in dialogue with each other? How do you think about if there is an event, a trend, a topic that you need to give both sides? Or is there a moment when you say, no, this is the right tool for the job. I'm gonna pull this character off the shelf for this moment. How do you think about building that world in more fullness?

Speaker 9: I I rarely use Colton now Okay. Because I think the world is exhausted of Colton. Sure. Like people when they see Colton on screen, they're like, I I just scrolled past five Coltons. They get it. I'm tired this guy. Sure. I don't wanna hear from him.

Speaker 1: I don't

Speaker 9: wanna see him. Constant is still quite novel because seeing the frown and seeing Gstaad

Speaker 2: and novel because the constants does not post their lifestyle on social media. Exactly. At to nearly the same degree.

Speaker 9: Yeah.

Speaker 2: Right? They're very sure. Using the humor and being like adopting the character. Mhmm. Of the people I know that fit that archetype are like incredibly private. Yes. Maybe they have a social media account but they'll they'll post If they were just posting at constantly, it would just seem like they were just flexing on the world constantly. Right? And so there's this weird awkwardness where there are certain types of people that sort of like full time consumer that it would be very distasteful if they were just documenting their life in the same way as Austin based wellness influencer. Totally. Totally. Because it'd be like, okay, we get it. You're at another hotel. We get it. You're at dinner.

Speaker 1: Okay. Yeah. Have a friend who was like, had to stop using social media because he learned how to fly helicopters and planes. And like, he was doing all this like insane stuff. And was he like, yeah, if I just buzz this, it looks like I'm flexing it.

Speaker 2: No. And I think that's why that's why the character resonates so deeply with like the next gen.

Speaker 1: Sure.

Speaker 2: Yeah. Because they're like, okay, I'm able to see something of myself on social And even though it's through satire, it's still like real.

Speaker 9: Yeah. Yeah. And they and they never got offended because ultimately it's even though it's poking fun Yeah. It's poking fun up. So it's celebratory. I'm poking fun at people's privilege. Yeah. And by design, that can never be offensive

Speaker 2: Yeah.

Speaker 9: Because it's privilege.

Speaker 1: So How much do you think about formats and testing new formats? I mean, you're uploading a video file, an m p four. Yeah. It can be shot on a phone. It can be shot on a cinema camera. You can edit a hype reel. You can do a lot of different things within the medium of Instagram reels within the medium of Instagram as a platform. How how often do you get the itch to to scratch some other format to take the character into a more cinematic world or a a more casual world? How much do you wanna do you wanna branch out? Because I know the default is like you will be punished by the algorithm if you do that. But I think every creator feels the urge every once in a while to say, I wanna I just want the experience of doing something at at twenty minutes or two hours or or shorter or whatever.

Speaker 9: I run the account, I think, in quite a unique way. Mhmm. And I started Gstaad Guy eight years ago now. So this is pre Reels feature.

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 9: Actually, Reels was pre launched, they were reaching out to certain video native creators Yeah. Creators and creatives online and paying them to start using Reels Interesting. Instead of Yeah. IGTV Yeah. Which was the past video feature.

Speaker 2: Oh, yeah. I forgot about that.

Speaker 9: And I was one of those early creators. So I had never the reason why I say that is I had never been led by the algorithm.

Speaker 1: Sure.

Speaker 9: I'd actually been led by my audience. Sure. And that's why I started the account. Mhmm. The way the account started was I filmed the video privately that went viral on WhatsApp. That's great. People sent it to each other. Yeah. And then someone stopped me on the street and said, hey, I got a video of you on That's crazy

Speaker 1: to get recognized From WhatsApp. WhatsApp video.

Speaker 9: And then I thought, okay, I should create an account. Yeah. There should be something here. Yeah. And I really felt at service to that first person who stopped me. Sure. And those initial followers who happened to be incredibly private, as you mentioned, and incredibly wealthy

Speaker 2: Mhmm.

Speaker 9: And hadn't engaged with this sort of content before.

Speaker 1: Mhmm.

Speaker 9: Now I have millions of followers Yeah. Which I'm very grateful for. But before I post, I'm still trying to service that initial niche audience. Mhmm. And it seems strange and novel online, but the way I like to think about it is actually a bit more like a restaurant.

Speaker 1: Mhmm.

Speaker 9: And no one questions us in restaurants, but they question it online Mhmm. Where, what's a better business model? In quotes. Is it a fast food chain that sells a lot of products at a very low price? Mhmm. Or is it a fine dining restaurant that sells very few products at a high price?

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 9: And the answer is whatever is right for the restaurateur. Yep. But there's no right or wrong. Of course. It's it's all up to them. Yep. And I happen to take the path of I don't actually care about the masses. Mhmm. If they're crowding around the restaurants and there's lots of people there and lots of views Yep. That's great. Mhmm. But really what I care about is the few people in the room Mhmm. That I really care in servicing

Speaker 1: Yep.

Speaker 9: With this very unique product. Yep. And and that's why these brands work with me.

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 9: The brands I work with could work with people that have far greater reach Mhmm. And far greater eyeballs. But instead, they work with me because of the fact that I have a few that they are struggling to reach.

Speaker 1: Hard to reach.

Speaker 2: That's the exact approach we took. Like, early on, now we have million and a half followers on X, something like that. But I still stand by our original intuition was that there's 200,000 people in the whole world that we really make content for, and every single show is developed for them. And you can imagine people joining the show, listening to a minute just being like, I don't know what these guys are talking about or what like, it doesn't seem important like what is super boring and and then leave forever. But then every day there's people that find the show and they're like, wow, I didn't know there was something that was like this curated around my set of interests and what I care about in business and markets and and some of the other topics that we touch. And it's like the best possible thing that you can do is just not chase like every single creator that is just doing the thing that gets them the most views on the next video, almost universally those audiences are not valuable. Yeah. And and it's actually like only only I would say mister beast is sort of doing that in a way where he's actually being like, what is the next thing that I can do that will be bigger than the last thing? Yeah. And that works for him because his whole sort of thing is like scale and how do I entertain a billion people. But for almost every other kind of like niche and category of creator, if you're just optimizing for going viral on the next video, you just lose the thing that made it great in the first place.

Speaker 9: I'm generally not an optimizer or like an engagement driven person, but there is one feature that I love on Instagram Mhmm. And that is see shared activity. Don't know if X has this. Mhmm. It's an amazing feature. Basically, it'll allows you to go to someone's profile and see how they've engaged with your account since the moment they followed you.

Speaker 1: Oh, interesting.

Speaker 9: The reason why that's important to me is because I have a table of archetypes. Sure. And I have the finance bro. Yeah. I have the The art collector. Art collector and and all these different of that I The wine aficionado. People that I talk to Sure. My advertisers about Yep. And I track how they're engaging with my content. Sure. And if I made a specific video for that archetype and that person did not engage with it, I Mhmm. Failed. Yeah. Even if it has millions of views. Yeah. Yeah. My priority was never to entertain. Yeah. Priority was to engage

Speaker 1: with It also feels like the the the characters and the brand, it would be so easy to slip into rage bait and have the entire audience be like, we hate this guy. Right? Yeah. Because like there's just a natural inclination for, oh, this is wealth stuff. Like, let's just Or even just completely fake like aspirational stuff for people that would never book a trip ever be but they're just scrolling in there like kids that, you know, would would would never have the opportunity or or maybe in, you know, years. But, yeah, dialing in that audience

Speaker 2: How you Yeah. How do you think that AI will impact luxury and hospitality in some of these categories? Because I've spent a lot of time thinking about it and I think it's like very almost like invincible to a lot of technology.

Speaker 1: If you operate a hotel in Saint Tropez, get ready for a thousand AI agents to call you every day.

Speaker 2: No. I mean, that's one way. But but but even then, it's like those kind of properties already have protections in place Yeah. The management team style of working with clients that Yeah. Is impervious to like, in many hopefully, like impervious to the Internet if if but but anyways, I've spent a bunch of time thinking of it and I'm coming up blank. When you think about categories like watchmaking, it's like I could not care less if the Holy Trinity is like using AI. Right? Mhmm. It's like, I don't I I I can imagine a way that like robotics could impact that, but hopefully it would allow them to do something that they've never been able to do before and being driven by the actual watchmakers themselves in a way that feels like they're carrying the brand forward. But when you think about like hotels, you can imagine AI agents that like you can text at all hours of the day and you get an instant response. But, again, you're still gonna be wanting to stay at a hotel where like there's a manager that you can talk to, that you can pass by in the hallway and they can support you on your stay and make it like excellent. Right?

Speaker 1: Mhmm.

Speaker 2: And so and you do the same thing with like fashion. Right? It still comes down to like what is the vision of the creative director and the people involved with the brands and the designers and all these different things. And like, again, you can imagine them using AI but I don't even I can't see it ever becoming like at the forefront or really imagining it like changing the way that like Bottega approaches like collections. Like it feels like some of these things are just like a dirt enduring and will just Mhmm. And remain the same way. But what's your view?

Speaker 9: I think we have to answer this question quite specifically. The reason why I think is because there's true luxury and craftsmanship Yeah. And there's true scale and optimization

Speaker 2: Yeah.

Speaker 9: And then there's the reality of the world which exists fluidly somewhere in between, with many hyper optimized businesses pretending to be craftsmans first Yes. And true luxury businesses. And I think AI kind of acts like a steroid, in the sense that if someone wants to be optimized, they can be more optimized than ever. Mhmm. But a hole in the wall French restaurant, if they wanted to optimize their booking process with OpenTable or Seven Rooms, they would have.

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 9: So it's not like they've been waiting for this AI optimization. They've they've resented everything anyway. They still have a corded phone.

Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. That's what I'm saying. They'd like the hotel has been resisting Everything. All this stuff for so long.

Speaker 9: They even resist air conditioning, some of the places. Yeah. You know? So like, I think it it's the optimized will become more optimized and therefore less luxurious.

Speaker 2: Sure.

Speaker 9: Therefore, these two poles we're talking about become more polarized, and the exclusive becomes more exclusive.

Speaker 2: Mhmm.

Speaker 9: So all the agents knocking on the door Yeah. What does that mean? The door becomes thicker.

Speaker 2: Yep.

Speaker 9: And they only allow the pre AI guests Sure. To join. And and I actually love a hotel. It's called Il San Pedro in Positano. It's a very special family owned hotel, farm to table. Over 70% of the guests are people that have stayed at the hotel for over ten years. Mhmm. And over 50% are over twenty years. So this is like a member's club without a membership. This is a true home. Yeah. A vacation home, really. And the new people who'd like to go there are by referral only. Mhmm. And that's why this whole new member's club thing actually kind of bugs me, because I think it's it's all just marketing, it's all kind of junk, where if you can just if the only barrier to joining a club and becoming a member is financial, it's not a real club. Yep. Should be based on values and knowledge and time and and connection or

Speaker 2: And some of these clubs like try to put on this like idea that that it's not like the second that you hit the form on the website. Send you By invite only. Yeah. If you

Speaker 9: pay a thousand dollars.

Speaker 2: They they they sort of intentionally they they you clearly they have an automation that's like, new user applies in two months, send them Yeah. The the sort of like

Speaker 9: It's I think I think the whole members club thing is also another topic that needs needs cracking.

Speaker 1: But

Speaker 9: it's a I think the those who have not optimized will not be optimized.

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 9: But, yeah. It will

Speaker 1: be How much are you traveling?

Speaker 9: A lot.

Speaker 1: Okay. Do you have a home base? Do you have multi home base? How much time do you spend in Europe versus America? Like, how would you even describe a normal year?

Speaker 2: He's gotta be on the circuit.

Speaker 9: Yeah. I'm I'm on the circuit a

Speaker 2: lot.

Speaker 9: Okay. Which is kind of funny, because the lifestyle I I poke fun at is not the lifestyle I live.

Speaker 1: Of course.

Speaker 9: I do it kind of differently

Speaker 1: This is yeah.

Speaker 9: Where I I it's I'm working, so I'm although I'm posting videos of these beautiful hotels Yep. I'm usually working at those beautiful hotels Sure. And not indulging the entire time.

Speaker 1: Of course.

Speaker 9: But I'm not complaining here. I'm also very blessed Oh, yeah. That I get managed to indulge Yeah. In between. I'm staying at hotels around the world probably eight months of the year.

Speaker 1: Okay.

Speaker 9: Yeah. 100 Yeah. Or I'm always on the move. Very cool. It's a it's a blessing, though.

Speaker 1: It's cool. Are you getting pulled away from Europe as your platform grows? Is there demand for what you've done for Europe? Let's see. We should get him to bring his audience to Asia. So it's worth us paying up or The Middle East. Yeah. I could see there being a lot of things where that clientele, it's almost higher LTV Mhmm. To get one of your audience members to visit a new territory. And so maybe there's more pressure or incentive for you to branch out. Yeah. But I'm sure there's a trade off there

Speaker 2: for you.

Speaker 9: What's funny is that I story tell a lot in Europe.

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 9: But most of my audience is in The US.

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 9: And that's the same way that the nicest hotels in Saint Tropez, their biggest spending customer base are Americans. Sure. And that's exactly what's happened to my page. It's actually this incredible US curiosity

Speaker 4: Yep.

Speaker 9: Of Europe and wanting to consume in Europe

Speaker 1: Of course.

Speaker 9: That has allowed my page to grow as fast as it has. So the biggest poll right now business wise is actually in The US Sure. Of US businesses wanting to be affiliated with this US way of sorry, European way of consuming

Speaker 1: Yep.

Speaker 9: And doing things, particularly in Switzerland and even Italy.

Speaker 2: Mhmm.

Speaker 9: I think luxury in Switzerland and luxury in Italy are unique to quality and craft

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 9: And substance. Yeah. While in France, example, historically luxury in French has had opulence tied to it. Mhmm. If you walk through a museum in France in

Speaker 1: these Yeah.

Speaker 9: Hallways, you have these beautiful gold and art and even the food, have this foam and cream

Speaker 2: and

Speaker 9: presentation. Meanwhile, you go an hour away to Milan or Switzerland and everything is incredibly simple. Mhmm. And it's all about the ingredients and the craft, and there's actually there's none of that gold hallway. It's actually pretty empty, simple, all about the substance.

Speaker 2: Yeah.

Speaker 9: And a lot of the brands that are approaching me in The US, wanting to work with me in The US, want me to bring that touch and that storytelling to their own businesses here.

Speaker 2: So it's so key. I mean, my biggest frustration with like sort of like commercial US hospitality is you have these properties that are worth like a billion dollars on paper and the actual like, there's no substance at all. Like Mhmm. Every restaurant has terrible ingredients. Right? And so there's all these like pockets of The US where like the actual like the natural landscape is incredible. Even the the the sort of like infrastructure that they have is incredible, but then the actual experience is like sort of Disneyland quality Yeah. You know, food.

Speaker 9: I see a lot of exceptions, and they're usually all family owned.

Speaker 2: Exactly. Exactly.

Speaker 9: Like, I recently went to San Isidro Ranch

Speaker 7: Oh, yeah.

Speaker 9: A beautiful property

Speaker 2: I love that property.

Speaker 9: In Santa Barbara.

Speaker 6: Yeah. It's amazing.

Speaker 9: And you feel like you're you're traveling because not nothing seems optimized.

Speaker 2: You mean, like, feel like you're traveling outside of

Speaker 9: the Are you turning outside the country? Nothing feels optimized. Yeah. Yeah. And you know, like, back to your AI question.

Speaker 2: Wait. And you'll you'll you'll appreciate this because I saw I saw a video that was somebody saying there's thousands of of European, small European hotels that are that need to change hands in the next ten years because Privateer there's no there's no Yeah. Was basically like somebody should make it was like an American Just

Speaker 1: ruin this.

Speaker 2: There was an American guy being like, we gotta roll up all these hotels because there's no one to inherit them. And this whole And because like the the kids moved away and whatever and I'm like Move the Yeah. So let's just like ruin the thing that made them great in the first place which is that they were family owned and they were designed to make enough money to stay in business, but not to just Yeah. Like extract and scale and and

Speaker 9: Unfortunately, private equity usually ruins luxury

Speaker 2: Mhmm.

Speaker 9: And doesn't actually create value and save jobs. It's usually too much optimization. And AI will ruin a lot of luxury too. Yep. And this is real luxury, I think. And if you have to optimize it, then it's kind of defeats the purpose. The whole point of luxury is that it's unoptimized. Yeah. It's a luxury.

Speaker 2: So you have a very American audience.

Speaker 9: Yes.

Speaker 2: Do you think Americans need to romanticize America more? Because I think the funny dynamic of like Euro summer is you'll have an American go over there and they'll just be like at some little hole in the wall restaurant, and to them it's like the most amazing like thing, and they're like, look, you get this just like espresso blah blah blah, you know, whatever it is. But you could actually find that like in a small town in like Idaho, you know, like if you really went looking Yeah. You could find it and you'd be like, wow, we're sitting here by this lake and there's this amazing little family owned sandwich shop. But it feels like people are only thinking in that way when they're outside of the country. But maybe that's just like a permanent truth. You can't appreciate what's in your backyard.

Speaker 9: I think saying all Americans is a stretch because this is a massive country. Yeah. I think saying the very wealthy city people in The US, let's take Miami, LA, Online New York

Speaker 1: as well.

Speaker 9: And the extremely online who are extremely exposed. Yep. I think they should really enjoy what this country has to offer before leaving every chance they get.

Speaker 2: Sure.

Speaker 9: There's so much to see and do in this country

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 9: Especially if you like outdoors and and being active. And I think the best people to learn from are actually the Swiss. What I love about the Swiss is that they really use everything around them. Yeah. A Swiss person who lives in a city or in the mountain, they ski every slope around them, they hike every trail, they sit on every bench, they try every cafe, they go to every weekend market. The Swiss really enjoy Switzerland.

Speaker 1: Mhmm.

Speaker 9: Yeah. And they know they have no reason to leave Switzerland. Mhmm. And I think Americans should enjoy America. Mhmm. Because you could literally like spend ten years not leaving this country and really change the way you think. And there's so much to see and do here.

Speaker 2: Mhmm. Easier to do in Switzerland because the whole It's country smaller. No. I just remember I have some like sort of mult multigenerational family friends that are based in Switzerland. And so my my family has been hanging out with that family across like grandparents, parents

Speaker 9: Mhmm. And

Speaker 2: and now my generation and going there the first time you're exactly right. It's like one the whole the whole country is like when I when I was a kid visiting for the first time I was like that's a golf course. Right? And they were like, no that's just like a random hillside. But like the American the American mind can't can't comprehend like Yeah. A perfectly like sort of naturally manicured Mhmm. Like hillside. Right? You just assume like, oh, it's clearly a golf course. Yeah. But then it's like, yeah, they they go hiking straight out of their backyard It's amazing. Straight up the mountain. And then when you go around driving around, they're like, oh, yeah. That's where I like paraglide and that's where, you know, whatever. That's where our bread's made. It's like Yeah. But finding your own version of Switzerland in America is possible.

Speaker 9: It is for sure. I recently went to Montana. Yeah. That was incredible. Yeah. It's I think Montana is a lot bigger than Switzerland as a state.

Speaker 1: Places in America was like, that's where I do donuts in my Hellcat. This happens.

Speaker 2: This is where my What does it what does it take to get a new a new kind of like spot on on your schedule? You're competing like I think like the the challenge that you have I'm sure is like for every event that you go to there's maybe like 10 or 20 others that you could probably use that that time for and then some of it is like set in place. Like Montana for example, like will you be at the ice race in Montana this coming year? Does that can that earn a spot or is there

Speaker 5: some I

Speaker 9: actually don't know what that is. Sounds cool.

Speaker 2: Interesting. Yeah. Yeah. It's they do this company, FAT, which is actually an old old company based out of Europe that is now adapted into they do a couple ice races, one in and one one in Big Sky. But it's like, it's amazing. It's it's Montana at its best Yeah. With a little European flavor.

Speaker 9: That that sort of thing I'd love to do. Yeah. I I really what I like to do is and what serves my business is to do what those core archetypes that I really value Yep. Are either doing or seeking to do. I think a great example of this is ten to fifteen years ago, the ultra high net worth jet set really loved fashion weeks. Mhmm. And they really wanted to go to fashion weeks. Sure. And now they all avoid fashion weeks.

Speaker 1: Mhmm.

Speaker 9: And in fact, if they live in a city where a fashion week is happening, they leave.

Speaker 1: Good.

Speaker 9: And that's because it became too online and too influencer pushed, which is kind of ironic that I'm going there. But it you know, it it's something happens where they actually don't like those things.

Speaker 2: Yeah.

Speaker 9: And now they, for example, avoid fashion weeks, they avoid a lot of the art events. They go to far more niche art moments, like for example, they used to go to Art Basel Miami.

Speaker 1: Most

Speaker 9: art people I know avoid Art Basel Miami at all costs. Yeah. Instead, they're in Venice, let's say, or Art Basel party.

Speaker 1: Not kidding about that.

Speaker 9: See, mean, there's if there's bachelor parties happening there, you know it's you know it's not about art. It has nothing to do with art anymore. Most people who go I think most people who go to Art Basel don't even realize there's a town called Basel in Switzerland. Yeah. They think it's a party in Miami. Yeah. And that's what makes these people kind of turned off by the whole thing. Totally. So I the circuit is not a fixed circuit. Sure. It's an ever changing thing that I

Speaker 2: as as soon as it's established as a circuit, it's already it's already out.

Speaker 9: It's too late. It's done. Yeah. It's too late. I think a good example of that is Mykonos.

Speaker 1: Oh, yeah.

Speaker 9: Yeah. Which is yeah. Over.

Speaker 1: Yeah. Unfortunately. Over.

Speaker 9: I mean, people are still

Speaker 2: Last question I'm curious about. Obviously work with a bunch of different brands and help them not only from an attention standpoint, but thinking through like their strategy to to actually improve their brands and reach the right people, etcetera. But how have you spent any time working with, let's say, like a a a newly minted tech billionaire or AI researcher type that that's just like, hey, I wanna accelerate my consumption from Mhmm. You know, the silly years one to five where they're just doing stupid stuff buying stupid cars and staying at the wrong places and helping them achieve, you know, the the next level of

Speaker 1: Mhmm.

Speaker 2: Of the latter.

Speaker 9: I am that friend to many people. Yeah. It's it's not at all a side of my business. Sure. People can watch my content and kind of grasp some of that. Yeah. But I have a lot of friends who text me and say, hey, I'm about to book this trip here.

Speaker 1: Yep.

Speaker 9: Is this cool? Yep. And I say, if you're asking if it's cool, you already know that you're gonna have a bad time.

Speaker 1: Because you

Speaker 9: shouldn't be going anywhere

Speaker 1: That's a good point.

Speaker 9: Because it's cool.

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 9: Go and explore and have a good time with your family, whatever. So I get a lot of inbound like that.

Speaker 1: Yeah.

Speaker 9: I love to help friends out. Maybe I should turn it into

Speaker 2: I think no. I think you because because I'm just thinking of it as like, there's people that are like, better or worse, they're like, I'm gonna spend $5,000,000 Yeah. Over the next five years on all these different things. And if you you can probably I I think you, you know, not to turn you into a course bro, but I think there's a high ticket offering where you basically say like, hey, you have to pay me like $200 or something like that, but I'm gonna help you actually design your life Mhmm. And your consumption in a way that that basically they'll make they'll basically save the money, right, that they would have spent on dumb things. So Yeah.

Speaker 1: You could also go down market to a new character sort of for like the average American, like, look. Nitro Circus is coming to Reno. You got a circuit. Get out there.

Speaker 2: I think you need to do that. Think

Speaker 1: I do. There's a monster truck rally coming around. Bam Margera's gonna appear. You gotta be there. It is cool. Get ready.

Speaker 2: That's a good place to end it.

Speaker 1: Thanks so much for coming to them. Thank you guys

Speaker 2: so much can

Speaker 8: close out the show.

Speaker 1: Thank you. Leave us five stars. Apple Podcast, Spotify. Sign up for newsletter, tbpn.com. We'll see you tomorrow

Speaker 2: Going flash bang.

Speaker 1: For a big event. Goodbye. Can't wait.

Speaker 9: You end the